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Thanks for Coming Back
Welcome to "Thanks for Coming Back," where every episode feels like a heart-to-heart in your favorite coffee spot. Hosted by Dr. Latasha Nelson, this podcast strips back the layers of leadership to reveal the real, relatable side of guiding and growing, whether you're a seasoned pro or just starting out.
Settle in with your brew of choice as Latasha shares her world of insights and experiences, blending wisdom with warmth in conversations that matter. It’s not just her stories, though; guests from all walks of life join in to share their own tales of triumph and challenge, adding flavors of diversity and depth to the mix.
"Thanks for Coming Back" is more than just a podcast—it's a community where we all learn and grow together. It's about tackling our challenges, getting better at what we do, and embracing the leader within. So come join the conversation, and let’s make leadership a part of our daily lives.
Thanks for Coming Back
Brand Authenticity in Leadership
Why is authenticity in branding crucial for genuine leadership? Join us for a deep dive into brand authenticity and leadership with Barry LeBeau, as he shares how early career criticism shaped him into a celebrated leader. Barry walks us through how turning negative feedback into a significant win is not only possible but essential, and why true authenticity and a unique approach are at the heart of impactful branding.
What does genuine leadership look like? Barry shows us that real talk and curiosity can be your most powerful tools. If you've ever been told your honesty is too much, Barry explains how straightforward, constructive feedback doesn't just build trust; it sets you apart as a leader. He'll share personal stories that underscore the importance of staying curious and offering valuable insights.
And what about resilience? Hear how Barry overcame early struggles in his songwriting career with the right people by his side—huge shoutout to Barry's wife for her unwavering support! Barry also discusses how vital it is to seek feedback, embrace humility, and pick the right allies to become a thriving leader as well as how recognizing our unique strengths—and those of our team—can transform everyday tasks into significant achievements.
Don’t miss this episode packed with actionable tips on building a strong brand, leading effectively, and navigating challenges with confidence.
Hey everyone, welcome back to. Thanks for Coming Back. I'm Dr LaTosha Nelson, and today we are in for a very special guest, mr Barry LeBeau. Imagine being told you have no talent and you should quit. Sounds crushing, right? Well, barry didn't just push through those harsh words, he turned them into a springboard for success, and now he's a guru in branding and leadership, teaching others how to stand out and stay true to themselves. Today he's here to chat with us about the wild ride of his career and the lessons on resilience and authenticity he's picked up along the way. So grab your coffee and let's get into it with Barry, all right, so I am going to ask you to repeat what you just said. You have been told what now? As a leader?
Speaker 2:Oh, as a leader, I have been told I have no talent. I should give up. I'm washed up. What I'm doing will never work. I've been told that many, many times and I've persevered. I've just blown right through those things and at times it was a setback, it was jarring. But you know, in a few cases the people actually meant well, they were trying to help somebody. That was all messed up. But you know what they were doing? They were projecting. That's how they felt about themselves. They felt that they couldn't pull it off, they couldn't do it. So, kid, I'm trying to save you all of that heartache. Just give it up Now. In other cases they were just flat out jealous or clueless, but they weren't going to stop me.
Speaker 1:I love hearing that. Okay, so let's build on this. You are an expert in the space of branding and I can only imagine that for those people who may have been trying to help you, that perhaps there was something in what they thought about branding that might've influenced the type of help that they were trying to give you. So if we can level set with our audience the importance of branding, what branding means, especially today, and how you leveraged that to become an awesome leader who said I'm just going to go forward and do it anyways, that would be amazing.
Speaker 2:Well, I think what's really important with branding is it's a word and people use it all the time and it's oh, it's this magical thing. Branding really is who you are. That's who you are. So Latasha is there. What is her brand? Do I trust her? Do I like her? Do I think she's sincere? Is she authentic? That's your brand when you are with people. And what's important is whether it's a business where you have many employees and I think you'll think this is interesting because I find it fascinating, fascinating Whether you have one employee, no employees, or you have a thousand, 10,000 employees your experience, the experience you deliver to others, is your brand, because people do not distinguish between how you treat them and what your brand is.
Speaker 2:I'll give you a quick example. If you have really wanted to buy a car and you saw a commercial on TV and you go into the dealership and you're so excited and it was a terrible experience, well, you walk out and you go I'll never buy that car, I'll never buy that brand. Well, the reality was, it was the experience that was lousy. I mean, you didn't find out that the car was bad. So, latasha, what's interesting is our experience. That we deliver to others is our brand in their eyes. So it doesn't matter if you're smart, doesn't matter if you know everything, if you're really not a good person to deal with. That is your brand.
Speaker 1:I almost want to ask you to repeat that, because I feel like people need to hear that again for a variety of reasons. But let's blow that out even further what makes for a strong brand and what can diminish a brand?
Speaker 2:Great question. Here's what I would like to share to the entire audience. And if you're an up and coming leader, or if you're established, and if, again, you have a lot of employees or none here's what's interesting you have to determine and then honor what makes you who you are, what makes you unique. So you're asking what makes a great brand? It's a person or a company that understands. You know, here are the two or three things that we do or that we stand for. These are the things that we do, that we really believe in, and this is who we are.
Speaker 2:Now, by the way, we're not for everybody. We're not one size fits all where everybody's gonna love us. No, but if you're looking for this, this and that, that's what we do. Now you ask a great question what diminishes it? It's when you commoditize yourself, when you try to be like everyone else, and we are pressured and in my book we call it the commodity monster. There it's a monster we are pressured to be commoditized, to lower our prices, to round off those sharp little edges, those little weird things we do or are. Oh, we just get rid of it because no one else does it. So that means it's wrong and we try to act and cost like everyone else.
Speaker 2:And what happens, latosha, is we stop having that passion for what we do and our employees, they go. Yeah, we're like everybody else. We used to be great, oh, we were amazing, but now there's no big deal. I mean, we're like everyone else. And then that's why employees leave, that's why employees may not do a good job. So that's our responsibility. We've got to say wait a minute, we do this, we do that responsibility. We've got to say wait a minute, we do this, we do that and we do this. This is who we are and, like I said, what's beautiful and it sounds scary, but it's actually beautiful is what we do, like what my company does is not for everybody. And boy does it feel good when you talk to somebody. Go, you know what, I don't think this is a good fit. And they go, you know I don't either. Because that means when you do think it's a good fit, you feel very, very passionate about it.
Speaker 1:So, as a leader, how can I apply that to the space that I'm in, especially if all that I know is all that I've seen, and generally what I've seen appears to be the same? How do I break free of? It's okay for me to be a different type of leader, because different doesn't mean bad.
Speaker 2:Well, what's interesting is different doesn't mean bad, and being differentiated doesn't mean you have to be superior in that way. So what's interesting is I hope I wasn't confusing, but it's accurate it's if you really do something in a certain way and this is the way you do it and this is how you believe it should be done. It doesn't mean you're saying, look, I am superior and everyone else is inferior. It's this is what I've found to really work, I really believe in it and this is how I do it. So what you're saying is right.
Speaker 2:The other thing is, if we're a little different and it's like oh well, you're just a little strange, or whatever, okay, celebrate that, that's good, because that's the meaning of the word remarkable. If you ever think about it, the word remarkable like oh, that's remarkable. What does that mean? Why did they come up with that word? It's because somebody would talk about it, somebody would remark on it. Oh yeah, that's blah, blah, blah. She's a little different. You're remarkable, right, because they made a remark. Otherwise, you're generic and with all of the technology today, all the AI, all of that, my gosh, you've got to be unique and you've got to be authentic and genuine.
Speaker 1:You know, interestingly so, I'm what I consider an AI enthusiast. I've been playing in it for well over a year now. I had the honor and the pleasure of speaking at an industry conference recently on how to leverage it to streamline your daily tasks, and one of the things I kept emphasizing is it is not going to replace you. There are things unique to your experiences and no matter how many people might have your job title, might be out in the same space doing the same job. You guys in the audience can't see my air quotes, but doing the same job. Right, you are unique in that aspect. There are so many podcasts out there, right? There are so many different forms of media. There's so many people on YouTube. It's not even funny, but people tune in, maybe for the same topics, but for the different personalities they select who resonates most with them. Can you speak to how to communicate in a way that resonates with your intended audience while not being so focused on who may not be your intended audience?
Speaker 2:Yeah, when I was starting out in business, I was involved with music, so I would write jingles, those irritating little ditties, okay. And I really struggled, really struggled, with selling. I just didn't want to sell. I was introverted and I thought, oh, I just don't want to sell. And it was kind of funny Once I embraced who I was and wasn't. I would sit down with a client and I would say, hey, you know, I'm a creative person and I love to really do great creative things. So basically, latasha, that was, I was telling them what my brand is, but I also told them what I wasn't and I said, you know, I'm not a sales person. So, as you and I are talking today, I'll probably miss some sales cues. So I just want you to know that. Now here's what's funny that turned into a very successful approach, because people would lean in and they would talk to me and they would go hey, this guy's not going to rip me off, because I let them know who and what I was, but also what I'm not.
Speaker 2:I'm not going to promise I can do all these other things, and it takes a little bit of courage to do it. After you start doing it, it's almost unthinkable to stop doing it because it becomes who you are. You know, I do blank and blank, but I don't do these other things Because, as you know, in personal life as well as business, you cannot be all things to all people, and the people who know that are the people you're trying to carry on a business relationship with. So best thing to do is not pretend, not try to please everyone by saying yes. You know yes can be a dangerous word. Oh, can you do this? Yes, oh, are you able to? Yes, oh, do you like to do this? Yes, oh, do you think that does that? Yes, oh, do you like to do this? Yes, oh, do you think that does that? Yes, oh, do you think blah, blah, blah, yes.
Speaker 2:One other thing I'll share is this I recently started working with a professional baseball team to help them with their marketing and we went in and my company was in competition with a lot of other competitors and you know they all promised a lot of the same things and I said look, here's where we're at and this is what we're about. I said we're gonna be very, very open and transparent with you and we're going to share what we think, not because we think we're always right, but we think that's our job. And they said, okay, so what about that? And I said, well, we have some positive and, we hope, constructive criticisms for some of the work you're doing right now, some of the things you're doing. They said, okay, share those with us. So we did, and we shared them for like half an hour. We think this could be a little better. Maybe you consider such and such. We think this and this and that. Maybe you could try that and all this. We got done and I had no idea if that went over well, if it went over poorly, if everybody else did it. But you know, we did it, latosha. So we won that project, which was great.
Speaker 2:And I talked to the president of the company a few weeks later and he brought up. I didn't even ask him, he brought up. He said you know, one of the reasons we work with you is because you, more than anyone else, gave us constructive criticism and insights, and we wanted that. The others told us everything was great, they loved everything we were doing. And he said I thought about it, I thought, you know, I want to work with somebody that's going to tell me the truth, and so that's part of a story, I think LaTosha, because we want to be friendly and we want everyone to think we're great and we're happy and we giggle and all that kind of stuff. I'm a friendly person. I just feel that I owe it to the person to be open and honest because it may help them.
Speaker 1:So what really speaks to me about what you just said is that, as leaders, it is so difficult to get feedback, and I have found some leaders who mean well, but they avoid telling the full truth. It's that whole sandwich approach. I think that's how they describe it you start with something nice, then you provide the actual feedback and then you sandwich it with something nice. And I'm not saying that that approach doesn't work for those that it may work for, but I have seen where it tends to water down the truth. So how do you approach having these conversations, these truthful, respectful conversations with people in a way that allows them to say, hey, I want more of that, versus okay, I'm ducking and dodging Barry for the rest of my life because he was so honest?
Speaker 2:Nobody has ever gotten upset when we've talked because we've been very friendly. I think if you're condescending and arrogant and egotistical, I think, yeah, that's ridiculous. But I look at it as if I'm in that person's position and they're turning to me to be an expert. I ought to be an expert. I shouldn't be an echo chamber. I should be an expert and I should share what I think, including asking some questions.
Speaker 2:I work with a very large healthcare network and they have a brand new facility and I went in there and I was talking to seven of their leaders the other day and we went through and it was a great experience and all. And I sat down with them and I said now I have one question. And they looked at me and I said what is this place? Is it a hospital? Is it a clinic? I said what is this? And they were very quiet, latosha. And then they broke up cracking up laughing and they said we ask that all the time. We don't even know what we are. So I said, okay, that's good, that's something we can work on together.
Speaker 2:So I think if you look at it from a purely selfless standpoint, you can help somebody with it. Now, if you want to stand out selfishly and say, hey, I'm a big deal and I'm going to prove how smart I am and how dumb you are. Okay, that's going to backfire. It should backfire and that's a waste. But we owe it to our potential clients to give our best to them, and our best will include compliments at times, but also sometimes some very important, insightful either criticisms or questions sometimes some very important, insightful, either criticisms or questions.
Speaker 1:I completely agree and I can see where knowing who you are that has to be a major influence and your ability to brand yourself genuinely and authentically authentic to who you are. So that's interesting that they shared with you very vulnerably hey, we don't know either and that you jumped on top of that. But I also love that. What I hear, or what I believe I hear, is that you intentionally practice curiosity, you engage to learn more consultatively so that you can help your clients. Can you speak to how that might look for an aspiring leader, somebody who thinks I might want to be in leadership but I'm not really sure what that looks like, or even a tenured leader who has had some challenges in that space? What does that look like?
Speaker 2:Well, I'll tell you what I don't like, that I would love your audience to at least consider as something that they could watch out for, and that is if you water down the idea of curiosity. It means just ask questions, and I don't just ask questions. So, as an example, latasha, I don't go. Well, why do you do this? Why do you do that? Blah, blah, blah. I don't do that because all I'm doing is throwing a bunch of stuff at somebody as if I am bringing value. Now, some of that is really important, but I also owe it to the individual. Even if I'm not going to work with them, there's no transaction. The individual even if I'm not going to work with them, there's no transaction. I owe it to the individual to share as well as just pull out of them answers to my questions.
Speaker 2:So I believe the most important thing is genuine curiosity and offering up possible either solutions or insights by saying okay, is it possible that what you're saying is X, or are you also saying such and such? And there's another way to do it, and that's called pattern matching. And if you pattern match, what it means is let's say you're talking to, let's say it's a hospital unit I was talking to and I say, hey, if this is not really called a hospital, might it be called something else? So, for instance, in other industries, something that's doing what you're doing here might be called a campus, or it might be called a such and such if it's in an educational institution. And what you can do is you can leave the world that you're in and go to a different universe, so to speak, and talk from that angle, not trying to sound too confusing, but you find ways to creatively allow the people involved to free their minds so they may come up with a better idea or solution.
Speaker 1:Yeah, what I hear you saying is you partner in solution with folks, you brainstorm with them, you ideate with them and you're very intentional about the questions you ask and how you process the answers you receive. I love that you called that out, because a lot of times it's easy to ask, well why? And you're asking all these questions without really processing the responses. You're just preparing yourself to respond again, maybe to throw out another question, and sometimes we get locked into because I think I already have the answer. But if you're genuinely and authentically expressing curiosity, you've gone into that situation saying I don't know everything. Let me find out what I don't know and let me partner with you to see if we can discover things together.
Speaker 2:What you're saying is really insightful. I'm a former musician and in my book we talk about jam sessions, so we will conduct at my company. We do marketing and training for companies all over the world. We will conduct a jam session, meaning we'll jam, we'll collaborate. The thing we do when we work with our clients to jam, the first aspect of it that we share with them is the most important part of jamming listening. And what you just described very well is that sometimes we're not listening, we're just getting ready to talk, and when that happens, it's not a good conversation.
Speaker 2:Have you ever been in a conference room and there are people talking, they're going through a whole you know a whole round of things that they're talking about, and then somebody raises their hand and go hey, I've got an idea, what about? Blank. And everybody looks at the guy and goes we talked about that half an hour ago. Well, it's because that person wasn't listening. He was getting ready to talk. And what I believe is most important and I'll share this because much of your audience is very young and I'm an ancient human being it works really good with young people because I was young, I was actually the youngest guy in a lot of the meetings I was in many decades ago. It works really well if you listen not just to the words but to the emotions and, as somebody is talking, if all of a sudden you hear them get excited about something, well you're going. No, wait a minute, there's something going on here. The other thing I think is interesting in these types of conversations and again I really share this, for the younger people in the audience.
Speaker 2:It's very easy to get intimidated by this older man or woman and they're the boss or they're the owner, or they're the CEO. Okay, but you know what? I force myself to not get caught up in that Latasha. So when I see somebody that's kind of intense or I see his or her employees kind of like shaking when this guy's talking because they don't want to get them upset, I purposely relax even more and I put myself into this mindset where I'm like this person's friend and I am willing to ask this person questions and suggest ideas, and his people or her people are looking at me like, oh my gosh, you're going to get killed.
Speaker 2:And routinely that person loves it and embraces it because he or she wants that. They don't want fear, they don't want people genuflecting in front of them. They want people that are engaging with them, and many of the leaders that are dealt with like this, many of those leaders so many of your young leaders will deal with these folks. Those older established leaders, they're pretty lonely folks. Those older established leaders, they're pretty lonely. There aren't a lot of people that are going to be warm, friendly but also honest, and if you can be that, even if your title isn't some highfalutin title, you can be that unique person that that leader listens to, and that's what you want. You want to be somebody that they actually go.
Speaker 1:You know, when LaTosha says something, I'm actually listening in front of anyone with a title because they don't want to be wrong or they don't want to say it and not sound smart. And I like to remind people that you are in the room for a purpose, regardless of what your role is, and if you've been asked a question, it's because or at least you should assume, let's assume positive intent that that person values, whatever your response is. And so leveling the playing field instead of looking and saying well, this person has a title, so I have to put them higher than I am. No, let's level that playing field here and say I am the expert, I am here for a reason. There's a reason that you asked me this question and I'm very pleased to answer it. And if I don't have the answer, I'm even happier to run that answer down for you.
Speaker 2:That's right. I think a couple things you said that really spur me on. Here is number one the young leader, the up-and-coming leader in that room with some other more established leaders, it's not your job to prove yourself. The result will be that you prove yourself okay, but that's not your job. Your job isn't that. Your job is to be valuable, and one of the keys I've used many, many times is I will have a disclaimer if I have a kind of a crazy question.
Speaker 2:So I will say if it's in the middle of a meeting, I'll go. Hey, at the risk of coming off like I'm kind of nuts or crazy, here there is a question I have. I may have missed it, but can you tell me why you do blank and black? Now, 90 plus percent of the time they don't say you're out of your mind and you're crazy, they go. Now, 90 plus percent of the time they don't say you're out of your mind and you're crazy, they go. You know that's a good question. Once in a while they'll say well, I mean, nobody in our industry does that, so it's really not applicable and I'll go. Okay, that's good to know and I won't feel bad, but I will do that little disclaimer. You know, maybe what I'm about to ask LaTosha is a little crazy, but I'd like to ask and it's blah, blah, blah and the point is the person will usually receive it. If you are a little off whack for your question, they may say yeah, latosha, that was a crazy question and everybody laughs. But you owe it to the person to do that, because that individual that you're serving or you're trying to help, they want somebody to really help.
Speaker 2:I work with a person who's been with me a long time and she's one of my longest-term employees and a great friend of mine, and I always say she has the nod N-O-D, the nod factor. And I'd say you know, kathy, you have the nod factor and she goes what's that mean? I go when you're in a meeting and you're talking with a client, the client's nodding their head like that little dog in the back of a car window and she has the nod factor. And it's because when she says something, you can tell she actually means it and it's insightful because she's been listening. So I like that. I think you could be 23 years old and have the nod factor, or you could be 73 and have the nod factor.
Speaker 1:I agree, you guys heard that.
Speaker 2:And.
Speaker 1:I think you referred to yourself as maybe a few years older than the intended audience. I would say you are experienced and seasoned and so, drawing on that, I would love for you to talk Sometimes there's a lot of seasoning.
Speaker 2:Sometimes you can put too much seasoning on, but that's another story.
Speaker 1:And sometimes you can not have enough. Okay, but can you share with us a little bit more? So, going from having had some folks say, hey, you're not right for this, you're not going to accomplish much with this, and still accomplishing so much in your experience, what have you learned? That's been really reverberating from your early days in your career to where you are now.
Speaker 2:A number of things have really helped me. When I was a songwriter, my wife and I went to New York and there was a very famous publisher and we met with him the first day and we had 40 appointments. Four zero 40 appointments that week in New York City. I walked in zero, 40 appointments that week in New York City. I walked in, he took my music, he listened for five seconds, said okay, let's go to the next song. Five seconds, again five seconds. And then he handed it back to me. He said, kid, you have no talent, you will never make it, and I thought it was funny. Then he said well, maybe in country music, but not in anything else. And I thought, oh, my gosh, what a crazy thing. He said so, kid, he said give it up, go back home. So I walked down. I didn't even have to walk out of the office, I could walk under the door. I felt so small, but anyway walked down to the street and I was immediately thinking, okay, I need to go back to Indiana with my wife, we gotta get a plane, we're done. And I said to her I said, well, we gotta get a plane. And my wife. So here's one thing I learned you gotta have the right people around you. My wife has been with me forever and she's the best person I've ever known. And she said do you think it's going to be like this every meeting? And I said it can't be. I said I have no talent. And she goes oh silly, come on, that's just one guy. Go to the next appointment. Now here's what's interesting, latosha, and I think this is a wonderful example.
Speaker 2:The very next appointment I went to was Billy Joel, the famous singer-songwriter, billy Joel's publishing company. I went in. I was still depressed from the previous meeting. I was sitting there just looking comatose. I'm sure the guy listened to all my music. I got up and I said okay, thanks a lot. Goodbye, he goes. Hold on, kid, he goes. What's wrong with you? I said well, this other publisher and I told him the name just said I have no talent. He said well, he tells that to everybody, said I have no talent. He said well, he tells that to everybody, he says that all the time. I said oh, and he said now, kid, I want to publish one of your songs. I said really, he goes, yeah. So he said I'm going to send you contracts Now.
Speaker 2:I had 38 more appointments. After that. No one else offered me a publishing job, but no one else told me I was useless. So the first one said quit. The second one said I'll buy it. And then 38 more were nice, but nothing.
Speaker 2:That's what I learned. I learned that you got to get out there. You got to give yourself a chance. If I had given myself one chance, I would not have gotten anywhere. I gave myself 40 chances. I didn't know which time it was going to work and it was the second time and it did work.
Speaker 2:So I think the things I have learned are you have to have the right people. If I had had a wife who didn't believe in me and said, ah, you're a loser, get out of there, I would have given up, but I didn't. I had a wife who really believed in me, and I think that's very important. We got to choose the people that are around us, because we got to be good to them, but they've got to be great for us, and if you're a leader, you need people around you who really honor you and they celebrate you. You don't need people around you that are constantly cutting you off at your knees, because there will be enough other people. So I've learned that.
Speaker 2:I also think that you, as one of my clients said, you don't know what you don't know, which means, hey, you're doing your best, feel free, Don't beat yourself up for not knowing certain things. Don't beat yourself up, and I used to do that. I used to beat myself up to inspire myself to perform, and now, in my old age, I don't beat myself up anymore. I go, yeah, you could have done better, barry, okay. But the other thing is I will tell myself good job, I will support myself, and I think that's important for leaders, because leaders are in a lonely position and that's not a negative. But if we all think about it, audience, if you are a leader, that means you are slightly ahead down the road Doesn't mean you're smarter, but you're down the road like a mile in front of other people, right, okay, that's lonely and you've got to realize you need people around you as much as possible that are good people.
Speaker 1:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Because much of leading is lonely.
Speaker 1:Now, as much as I cringe at the feedback you got from the first publisher, I'm also and maybe equally concerned about the lack of feedback you got from the other 38. As leaders, having the right people around you is important, but getting feedback so that you can grow and help others grow is equally important. What do you recommend? What kind of tactics and strategies can leaders use to get feedback when it's probably not going to be willingly offered to them?
Speaker 2:Well, what I did when I started my business and I was a terrible salesperson is I and I want your folks to do this I walked around, called people up and said, okay, who's the best salesperson in town? And they said oh, it's this guy named Mike. So I said okay, I called Mike up one day and I said hey, mike, you don't know me, but I've heard you're the best salesperson in town. I know you're busy, but could I buy you lunch or could I at least ask you a question sometime? And he said well, barry, what are you doing at 1130 today? And I said nothing. He said okay, well, let's have lunch at this restaurant. I said Mike, today he goes. Yeah, I said I didn't think you'd have time. And he said and this is important for your audience he said do you realize, almost nobody asks me for my help. So when somebody does, I want to help them every bit I can.
Speaker 2:So one of the things is you humble yourself. If you're not the best at sales, find somebody who is and just talk to the person. If you're not the best at analysis, or you're not the best in profit and loss statements or whatever it is, go find somebody that's good and say, okay, I am terrible at this, how do you do this? And I'll tell you what. You make friends. Mike is still one of my dearest friends and he was such a help for me and he loved that he could help me. So I think we humble ourselves, latosha. We identify where we're weak and we go who is good at this? And I'll tell you, I dare anybody in the audience to try that and get rejected. I don't think you'll find anybody that says, no, I don't want to talk to you, I won't help you. I mean, I haven't had anybody that has said that.
Speaker 1:That's amazing and I echo that challenge because it can be scary. You have to want the feedback and even if you think you want the feedback, the fear of rejection can sometimes hold us back. So I echo that challenge to everyone. Whether you're doing well or not, you can always aspire to do better. So seek that feedback, ask for help. I think humility is such a huge factor as a leader and it can be challenging. What have been some of the biggest challenges you've had to face as a leader, and especially when it comes to branding? I can only imagine how many people that you've had to. You know that you've wanted to help that may or may not be in the right spot to receive your help.
Speaker 2:Well, I do agree with you on humility. I think that the funny thing is, a lot of people would say leaders can't be humble. I mean, they've got to be powerful. I think you have to be very humble and have a lot of humility if you want to be a great leader. I think some of the best leaders are the ones who never wanted to be a leader. You know, I never wanted to lead. I never wanted to run a company. So it's kind of not an egotistical thing for me to run a company. I never wanted to. I think that's important.
Speaker 2:You know, the folks that I've tried to help in branding. The ones that I feel were the biggest challenge were the ones that I would call a seagull. A seagull which is a leader who is not really a good leader. It's a person who is over a group of people and this person doesn't really pay attention to what's going on and gives lip service to his or her people, saying oh yeah, you can do it. Yeah, yeah, put it together Great. And that person, that seagull, leaves and then a while later it could be weeks later they swoop back in and they dismantle everything. This isn't good. I don't like that. Blah, blah, blah and they're proving in their minds that they're important and that they're really straightening things out, but what they're doing is they're tearing down their people, and I've had to resign several accounts because we were working with a seagull and I've told the clients they were seagulls because their people were getting beaten up and their people would beat my people up, and that's a danger for a leader.
Speaker 2:We're supposed to find people that are quote better than us and let them do it. Okay, I don't think that's exactly it. I think you find great people and you work with them and you are constantly their leader. So you're guiding them or giving them feedback and celebrating them, but at the same time, then you've got to step back in that case and allow them to do things that will definitely be different than what you would have done Not necessarily wrong. So I think some leaders look at, if you're going to do it differently, then that's wrong and the point is, different isn't necessarily wrong. So some leaders come in, they swoop in, they think they're coming off as powerful and strong and all they're doing is they're just, you know, crushing people's hearts and souls. Only they have to go repeat the process again. So that's the biggest one I've ever run into.
Speaker 1:Wow, seagull, I can't get that imagery out of my head, so I'm literally watching them.
Speaker 2:Right, they swoop on in and make a mess.
Speaker 1:Yeah, barry, tell us about your book and what our audience can get from it. That would help them navigate leadership.
Speaker 2:I think the book would be great for your audience, and here's why it's called the Power of Differentiation and differentiation is 15 letters long, it's six syllables. Some people can't even pronounce it, you know, but it's a great word because so much in leadership, whether it's personal branding or company's branding, it's all about identifying what makes you unique, not trying to create what makes you unique so that you can be like everybody else. It's like no, no, here's what you are, this is how you do it and identifying it. So often we are too close to it. We're too close to what makes our brand, our product, different or unique and we think it's just okay and we denigrate it. We have to have pride in it, we have to identify it. We have to name it. You know one thing I also share with clients. They do something really unique and I go well, what do you call it? And they have no name for it. I go okay, well, you have children, don't you? And the person will go well, yeah, I have three kids. I go do you have child one, child two and child three? Or do they actually have names? Well, no, where's child two? Get your child three? Get over here. You don't do that. They have their identity. So you name that uniqueness. Okay, you name it. But the most important thing and I love this part of it, this is my favorite part is, before you launch it to the world, before you tell the world, you celebrate it with the most important people, and that would be your employees. It would be anyone who supports you. Everybody needs to know why we're doing what we're doing and why it's important and what that does. Latosha is magical because it provides significance to people.
Speaker 2:I work with a wonderful ambulance company and they have many different brands and I went through their factory and I talked to a young gentleman and I said hey, what do you do? And he said I plug in wire harnesses. And I said, okay. I said what else? He said sometimes I tighten a bolt. I said, okay, that's good, he says, but I'm going to leave. There's a marshmallow factory down the road and I can make 25 cents an hour more and I'm going to leave. I said, okay, well, let's think about this before you leave. I said each ambulance lasts 10 years. During those 10 years, over 10,000 people will be inside that ambulance. Now, it could be the driver, it could be the emergency technicians. It could be the patient or the patient's family. Okay, so 10,000 people over 10 years and in that 10-year period those 10,000 people are either protected or their lives are saved by that ambulance. And he went.
Speaker 2:I just thought I was in the wire harness business. I didn't think I was in the life-saving business, and I said you might be in the life-saving business. So think about this, and this is what our book's all about LaTosha If that guy, really smart, young guy, feels he's in the life-saving business, here's what I think will happen. He'll probably stay at the job. He probably won't leave for a quarter more an hour. Maybe it would be $2 an hour, but not a quarter.
Speaker 2:He probably will make sure he's plugging those harnesses in really well. He'll make sure that the people on the line are doing their job because, hey, people, we're saving lives here. And you know what he might feel like he's doing something special. He might have pride. That's what we have to do. So that's what the book is about, and the book covers a wide range of stories that illustrate all this. It is also virtually a how-to book. You could go through the book you don't have to hire my company and you can learn a lot of what we would have done. So it's, I think, very entertaining. You meet a lot of really great people and it's a humble book about really positive people doing great things.
Speaker 1:So, for very selfish reasons, what I love most about the story you just shared is that you showed how to be a leader in that moment. A lot of people just think they just do something. They don't associate the impact or the influence that they have in the role that they have. And I would like to think that his direct leader would have said to him hey, you know what what you do is so critical to what we do? Because without you we couldn't save the lives that we save, we couldn't help those that we help. But you did it in that moment you didn't have to, wasn't your job? Again, with the air quotes people I'm so sorry you can't see them, but it wasn't your job to do that. But it was something that you did as a leader, very innately to show him in a very quick moment the impact that his role has, regardless of that 25-cent differential. And now, for this young man, he sees the actual impact of the role that he has, regardless of the title impact of the role that he has, regardless of the title.
Speaker 2:Right, and he, just like you talk about so often, he can demonstrate leadership without the title, because he's saying come on, everybody, we've got to make this right, we're saving lives here. And, by the way, his leader you're correct did not say those things initially, not because the leader was evil, it's because the leader didn't think about it. The leader was so caught up in everything else and the leader needed to stop for a moment and go. No, wait a minute. We have to share this with everybody because the leader felt it herself as well. She really felt that way. She just wasn't sharing it. She hadn't stopped to give that positive message to herself and anyone else. And that's what I help to do. That's why what I do is you know, I'll help those folks. I never go in and scold the leader and say, oh, you're being terrible, I'm opening their eyes. So they go oh my gosh, look what we're doing. And it makes them feel better.
Speaker 1:You're absolutely spot on. I think we're just human and we think we just do this. Spot on, I think we're just human and we think we just do this. I am just this role and it is not the case. You are not your position, you are not your title, and you have the ability, with help from folks like you, where we can kind of step back and reflect on wow, this is the real, true impact of what I do, or just reflection as an, as a, you know, intentional activity in your day-to-day, to say what was it that I did today, even if it wasn't related to your role? Maybe you smiled at someone and that did wonders for their day and, consequently, everyone thereafter that they interacted with Right. So I agree with you, it is not necessarily that the leader did something wrong. It's just that we all need help sometimes seeing the impact that we can have on others.
Speaker 2:Well, I love what you said and you've said this two different times, so I've got to jump on it because it's in my book and it's the power of words. There are 200,000 words in the English language 200,000. And what you said is directly in my book, where people denigrate their brands or themselves and they go well, we're just a local, such as we were just a manufacturing, blah, blah, we're just. You can't be just a. So if you want to talk about personal branding, if someone says, what do you do? And you go well, I'm just a, stop it. Or I'm a local. No, stop it, stop it. Well, we're, we're just kind of a. No, stop it. You're not just kind of a. You've got to be able to say, hey, we build ambulances and each ambulance saves 10,000 people in its lifetime and my job is to make sure those ambulances do it every single day of the week. And you go woo, wow. And that's what we have to do If we learn nothing else.
Speaker 2:What you just said is fantastic Get rid of this, just Get rid of it. Stop these diminishing terms that we use about ourselves or our company. I'm just such and such, I'm just a. We cannot do it and nobody wants to work with just a Nobody wants to be a friend with just a Nobody wants to buy from just a company. Nobody wants to buy from just a company. So great point there, latasha, and you teed it up. I loved it.
Speaker 1:Absolutely so. What final words or advice would you give to our audience when it comes to their brand and developing it Correction, developing a strong, authentic and genuine brand and how they can take that and be the most impactful leaders in their space, regardless of title.
Speaker 2:My insight is this be yourself, celebrate and honor yourself, be humble. So if you have weaknesses which every single person does go to find people who are strong and just talk to them. I mean, worst case scenario, you don't learn anything. You're not going to be worse. You just had a nice talk with somebody who's really good at something. I think what's really really critical is you are not here to be like someone else or to create yourself into the image of something else. You are really here to do one, two or three things a little different than other folks, which in the eyes of some, will be better. That'll be a better choice. Now others will say I don't care. So focus on those couple of things that you do, those couple if it's a business, those couple of projects or products or services you offer that are different. And then the final thing I would also say we talked about early in the show is your experience when I work with you.
Speaker 2:If you're a personal brand, what is it like? Is it authentic? Is it friendly? Are you right on top of it? Do you have ideas friendly? Are you right on top of it? Do you have ideas? That's what is so important, because people forgive imperfections. It's not about perfect. So never fall into the perfect trap, which is one of my chapters in the book. Never fall into the perfect trap. You don't need to be perfect. What you want to do is identify, not 115 things you do great. How about two, two things you do that are pretty neat and then celebrate those?
Speaker 1:Now tell us where we can find the book and tell us how we can stay connected.
Speaker 2:You can find the book all over the world because it's being distributed through Simon Schuster. So it's on Amazon, but it's a lot of other places. Please buy it, but also review it. I'd love you to review it. I think that's fun to do, like one or two sentences doesn't have to be a Shakespearean review, but review it. Here's what I liked, here's what I saw, so you can buy it there.
Speaker 2:You can reach me in two different spots. My last name is Labov L-A-B-O-V, so I'm at labovcom and you can leave a message. You can look at what my company does for all these great brands worldwide. Or you can go to my personal site, barrylabovcom, where you actually can learn a little bit about some of the rock bands I was in when I had hair. You can look at a few other books, some other things. It's a little bit of a wacky website and it's a little bit of fun. So a couple of ways, but I'm not looking for transactions. I'd like to influence a million people with the message. That's what my goal is, and if I can help anybody or answer any questions, that to me is a success story.
Speaker 1:Amazing. I really enjoyed our conversation today. Thank you so much for being genuine and authentic and sharing your experiences with us and for sharing so many awesome stories that really illustrate If you could not imagine what we were talking about. I think all of your insights and stories really helped to bring those to life. So thank you so much.
Speaker 2:Well, latosha, before you sign off, I have to compliment you. I think you are such a wonderful, sincere and insightful person. It's been a pleasure and I know your audience can feel that. So that's your brand. That is why people love you. So thank you for being my host today. As I am the guest, and I'm very honored to have been with you today, it's been a true pleasure.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much. And just like that, we're wrapping up another fantastic chat here, and thanks for coming back. Barry really gave us a lot of food for thought, didn't he? From overcoming negativity to helping others shine in their unique ways, he's shown us that what sets us apart can really be our greatest strength. If today's talk struck a chord with you, consider sharing it with a friend who might need a little inspiration or maybe even a fresh perspective. Don't forget to hit that subscribe button so you never miss out on our talk, and take a moment to think about what makes you unique and how you can use that to your advantage. Thanks for joining us and remember to stay curious, embrace challenges and take the lessons learned to make meaningful changes in your life. And don't forget leadership isn't just about titles, it's about action. Until next time, keep leading, keep learning, and thanks for coming back.
